Packers decline Quay Walker 5th-year option (but...)

[Labrev]

[go pak go]

I'm curious if they are thinking a 1 year extension. 2 year extension. A legit extension (and cheaper 2nd contract)....

Very curious to what they come up with.

[RingoCStarrQB]

Was it Quay who was unstable for a bit? I know they're all individuals. Some snap out of it .... some don't.

[Labrev]

5th Year option at LB includes EDGE players, so it is pretty outrageously expensive. Jaguars declined LB Devin Lloyd as well, fwiw (not sure).

I think this just means they don't want to pay him elite EDGE money for a year, but I think they will offer him a real extension, not a Jordan Love prove-it deal. Walker gets glowing praise from lots of people on the team, and he had a stretch of great play in the second half of last season.

If they feel like that second half finish means he turned a corner and is a sign of what's ahead, you have an elite player at the position. And the way that our guys talk him up, from coaches to players, I think the org is genuinely bullish on him.

[Labrev]

Was it Quay who was unstable for a bit? I know they're all individuals. Some snap out of it .... some don't.

He got ejected for personal fouls a couple times early on with us. It has not been an issue recently.

[lupedafiasco]

Extension? For what? He hasn’t done anything. Make him earn it.

[NCF]

Extension? For what? He hasn’t done anything. Make him earn it.

That is exactly what a short-term extension would do. 5th-year option not even on the table since the NFL includes EDGE players with off-ball LB's for some ridiculous reason.

[BF004]

Extension? For what? He hasn’t done anything. Make him earn it.

That is exactly what a short-term extension would do. 5th-year option not even on the table since the NFL includes EDGE players with off-ball LB's for some ridiculous reason.

Which is dumb, but known, which is also why it's dumb to take an off ball LB in the first round, when you know the 5th year option is worthless.

[lupedafiasco]

Extension? For what? He hasn’t done anything. Make him earn it.

That is exactly what a short-term extension would do. 5th-year option not even on the table since the NFL includes EDGE players with off-ball LB's for some ridiculous reason.

You’re still rewarding him. There shouldn’t be any talk of an extension until he plays better. Short extension or not. He’s coming into year 4 and has been nothing but average. He’s not even LB1 anymore.

[Pckfn23]

Building effective NFL teams is more than just signing/resigning of Pro Bowl caliber players and letting the rest walk. Teams can't be built without roll players and some players that just get the job done for the most part. Guys like Avonte Maddox, Jack Driscoll, and Dallas Goedert come to mind right off the bat for the Eagles that helped them to a Super Bowl win, were resigned, but weren't Pro Bowl caliber players.

[Pckfn23]

Looking at the 2024 Eagles, they only had 8 players on their roster that had started with them and been resigned after their rookie contract.
Brandon Graham
Lane Johnson
Dallas Goedert
Avonte Maddox
Josh Sweat
Jack Driscoll
Jordan Mailata
Jalen Hurts

That's really interesting to me, on a lot of levels.

[go pak go]

Looking at the 2024 Eagles, they only had 8 players on their roster that had started with them and been resigned after their rookie contract.
Brandon Graham
Lane Johnson
Dallas Goedert
Avonte Maddox
Josh Sweat
Jack Driscoll
Jordan Mailata
Jalen Hurts

That's really interesting to me, on a lot of levels.

I bet you it's actually very common for teams to be in that 6 - 10 range. Generally a team will have 8 - 12 or 8 - 14ish players on 2nd+ contracts.

The Packers 2025 Roster has 6 players that we drafted and on their 2nd+ contract:

Jordan Love
Rashan Gary
Jaire Alexander
Kenny Clark
Elgton Jenkins
Isaiah McDuffie

We effectively have another 5 players who are on 2nd+ contracts but acquired via UFA rather than us drafting them:

Xavier McKinney
Josh Jacobs
Aaron Banks
Keisean Nixon
Nate Hobbs

I don't consider vet minimum guys like Hardman as I put them in basically the same category as an Rights Tender/RFA/UDFA pool. They are roster fillers.

[Pckfn23]

Looking at the 2024 Eagles, they only had 8 players on their roster that had started with them and been resigned after their rookie contract.
Brandon Graham
Lane Johnson
Dallas Goedert
Avonte Maddox
Josh Sweat
Jack Driscoll
Jordan Mailata
Jalen Hurts

That's really interesting to me, on a lot of levels.

I bet you it's actually very common for teams to be in that 6 - 10 range.

The Packers 2025 Roster has 6 players that we drafted and on their 2nd+ contract:

Jordan Love
Rashan Gary
Jaire Alexander
Kenny Clark
Elgton Jenkins
Isaiah McDuffie

100%, I hadn't actually realized that number was so low.

[go pak go]

Looking at the 2024 Eagles, they only had 8 players on their roster that had started with them and been resigned after their rookie contract.
Brandon Graham
Lane Johnson
Dallas Goedert
Avonte Maddox
Josh Sweat
Jack Driscoll
Jordan Mailata
Jalen Hurts

That's really interesting to me, on a lot of levels.

I bet you it's actually very common for teams to be in that 6 - 10 range.

The Packers 2025 Roster has 6 players that we drafted and on their 2nd+ contract:

Jordan Love
Rashan Gary
Jaire Alexander
Kenny Clark
Elgton Jenkins
Isaiah McDuffie

100%, I hadn't actually realized that number was so low.

It's why I keep saying draft positional needs don't matter. I think fans completely underestimate that rosters undergo almost an 80% turn in a 2 - 3 year period. Much more effective to say the 1 - 2 positions you don't need in a draft because you have a franchise QB and are deep in maybe one other position.

[Pckfn23]

Looking at the 2024 Eagles, they only had 8 players on their roster that had started with them and been resigned after their rookie contract.
Brandon Graham
Lane Johnson
Dallas Goedert
Avonte Maddox
Josh Sweat
Jack Driscoll
Jordan Mailata
Jalen Hurts

That's really interesting to me, on a lot of levels.

I bet you it's actually very common for teams to be in that 6 - 10 range. Generally a team will have 8 - 12 or 8 - 14ish players on 2nd+ contracts.

The Packers 2025 Roster has 6 players that we drafted and on their 2nd+ contract:

Jordan Love
Rashan Gary
Jaire Alexander
Kenny Clark
Elgton Jenkins
Isaiah McDuffie

That's a pretty interesting comparison with the Eagles. They had 5 of their 8 2nd+ contract guys who were Pro Bowl caliber players. We had 4 of our 6 2nd+ contract guys who were Pro Bowl caliber players.

In 2021 we had 9 guys who were 2nd+ contract guys, 6 were Pro Bowl caliber players.

Interesting. Would have to really dive into all teams to see if it makes any difference either way. One thing is very clear, teams are making hay with 1st contract guys and only a couple handfuls of 2nd+ contract guys that started with them.

[go pak go]

Looking at the 2024 Eagles, they only had 8 players on their roster that had started with them and been resigned after their rookie contract.
Brandon Graham
Lane Johnson
Dallas Goedert
Avonte Maddox
Josh Sweat
Jack Driscoll
Jordan Mailata
Jalen Hurts

That's really interesting to me, on a lot of levels.

I bet you it's actually very common for teams to be in that 6 - 10 range. Generally a team will have 8 - 12 or 8 - 14ish players on 2nd+ contracts.

The Packers 2025 Roster has 6 players that we drafted and on their 2nd+ contract:

Jordan Love
Rashan Gary
Jaire Alexander
Kenny Clark
Elgton Jenkins
Isaiah McDuffie

That's a pretty interesting comparison with the Eagles. They had 5 of their 8 2nd+ contract guys who were Pro Bowl caliber players. We had 4 of our 6 2nd+ contract guys who were Pro Bowl caliber players.

In 2021 we had 9 guys who were 2nd+ contract guys, 6 were Pro Bowl caliber players.

Interesting. Would have to really dive into all teams to see if it makes any difference either way. One thing is very clear, teams are making hay with 1st contract guys and only a couple handfuls of 2nd+ contract guys that started with them.

My guess is most of your top 3 - 4 teams in each conference will have a similar makeup of 2nd contract guys and pro bowl caliber. It's often why the top 3 - 4 teams in each conference are seperate by 2 games or less in the standings.

The real ticker is then which playmaker steps up in January or which team/player doesn't make the big blunder (dropped balls, turnovers, etc.). The story of the 2023 Packers was blunders (Nixon and Savage dropping INTs). The story of the 2024 Packers was very different as our Oline just got man handled in addition to our receivers dropping a ridiculous number of balls.

[lupedafiasco]

I bet you it's actually very common for teams to be in that 6 - 10 range.

The Packers 2025 Roster has 6 players that we drafted and on their 2nd+ contract:

Jordan Love
Rashan Gary
Jaire Alexander
Kenny Clark
Elgton Jenkins
Isaiah McDuffie

100%, I hadn't actually realized that number was so low.

It's why I keep saying draft positional needs don't matter. I think fans completely underestimate that rosters undergo almost an 80% turn in a 2 - 3 year period. Much more effective to say the 1 - 2 positions you don't need in a draft because you have a franchise QB and are deep in maybe one other position.

I would say if there is an 80% roster turnover in 2-3 years and rookie contracts are just 4 years then drafting for need is even more critical so that a team can get value from their contracts. Late day 2 and day 3 sure. Take the BPA because those players are all developmental prospects anyways.

Round 1 and 2 though you need to get value. 0 value is taking a Rashan Gary and having him play a reserve role for 3 years. LVN being in a reserve role for 2 years so far. Jordan Morgan not being a starter. Jordan Love is fa fine QB but for 3 years we got no value from our top pick in a championship window. Devonte Wyatt has been a rotational player for 3 years. Then you have the other side of the coin where Gutenbumst does draft for need, its not that his process is wrong. He just goes and takes the wrong player like Savage, Stokes, Walker, Watson.

And if you feel like you arent going to have a player that will offer value go and make a move to get one. Again, Gutenbumst has done this hes just done an awful job when it comes to it. He does a good job moving back and getting decent players but he does a terrible job moving up and getting premier talent and thats why this team has such a lack of starpower on it from our draft.

Credit where its due. The pro personnel scouts on this team are incredible. Really the only times theyve missed is Jimmy Graham and that atrocious Billy Turder deal. Deals like Zadarius, Preston, Amos, McKinney, Jacobs (I would never sign a RB but they got the talent right) and finding guys like Sullivan or Campbell for peanuts are all smashes.

[go pak go]

100%, I hadn't actually realized that number was so low.

It's why I keep saying draft positional needs don't matter. I think fans completely underestimate that rosters undergo almost an 80% turn in a 2 - 3 year period. Much more effective to say the 1 - 2 positions you don't need in a draft because you have a franchise QB and are deep in maybe one other position.

I would say if there is an 80% roster turnover in 2-3 years and rookie contracts are just 4 years then drafting for need is even more critical so that a team can get value from their contracts. Late day 2 and day 3 sure. Take the BPA because those players are all developmental prospects anyways.

Round 1 and 2 though you need to get value. 0 value is taking a Rashan Gary and having him play a reserve role for 3 years. LVN being in a reserve role for 2 years so far. Jordan Morgan not being a starter. Jordan Love is fa fine QB but for 3 years we got no value from our top pick in a championship window. Devonte Wyatt has been a rotational player for 3 years. Then you have the other side of the coin where Gutenbumst does draft for need, its not that his process is wrong. He just goes and takes the wrong player like Savage, Stokes, Walker, Watson.

And if you feel like you arent going to have a player that will offer value go and make a move to get one. Again, Gutenbumst has done this hes just done an awful job when it comes to it. He does a good job moving back and getting decent players but he does a terrible job moving up and getting premier talent and thats why this team has such a lack of starpower on it from our draft.

Credit where its due. The pro personnel scouts on this team are incredible. Really the only times theyve missed is Jimmy Graham and that atrocious Billy Turder deal. Deals like Zadarius, Preston, Amos, McKinney, Jacobs (I would never sign a RB but they got the talent right) and finding guys like Sullivan or Campbell for peanuts are all smashes.

Lot to unpack here.

Most of the issues you have (players like LVN, AJ Dillon, Eric Stokes, etc.) aren't necessarily their position but rather the player just isn't or didn't perform.

There is plenty of opportunity for virtually any player to see signficant snaps if the player is good. The only real limit was Jordan Love who couldn't take snaps until 12 was out of the picture.

Even Morgan had plenty of opporunity to take snaps and did take snaps and was starting to see even more snaps until he got hurt.

I don't want to confuse poor position to player just wasn't good enough or was injured. And yes I will agree that Gute needs a better performance at picking actual players in the draft. He's not nailing his draft picks but it isn't because the position wasn't warranted. It's because the player just didn't end up being good.

[Scott4Pack]

I am not going to read into this one bit. Walked is good. Not elite. He's worth paying a certain amount. But he isn't so good that we don't prefer a modest deal before end of the year. Let him see if he hits the ground running like end of last year. That would change his value. He AND the GBP would appreciate that!

The other side of that is, we don't want to overpay a ILB. No way, especially since 1) another decent one can be had at a modest contract, and 2) we have Edge!

[RingoCStarrQB]

Quay's jersey # selection never made any sense to anyone. 7 is Majik's.